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Temp and RH fluctuation

Len___T

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I keep my humidor in our "storage" room. Its the darkest, coolest room in the house. Well while seasoning my humidor I ordered the 65% beads from heartfelt. They came in and following someones post here in this thread I seperated some from the tube to keep dry in order to control humididty fluctuations, and left the rest moistened with distilled water. What I want to know is why does the temp/rh hover arounf 68-62 % in the storage room? Yet, say I move it to the front room and it goes up to 70+ degrees and the rh stays at 65 as per the beads ? Is it because the humidor is a 300 count humi and its not filled? As someone elses thread stated "if the humi's not full it's hard to regulate" So yeah I been perusing the site lol. thanks alot....len


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Jwrussell

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Well, yeah, it's harder to regulate a not full humi, but that does seem a bit strange. It's possible that the temp in your storage room fluctuates more than the temp in the front room? If that's the case it could account for those fluctuations. Otherwise, I'm not sure. What's the temp and ambient RH in both rooms?
 

cvm4

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I noticed a full humidor is a steady RH humidor :wink: Oh and what's up with the neopets link?
 

Len___T

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I dont know what temp and rh is in both rooms...I know the front room is warmer than the others though...I'm on neopets and wanted to use the referral link as my sig...Is that not allowed? ty
 
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Ok this is going way back to my chemistry days but I remember something about relative and absolute humidity. I'm going to need help with this one because I don't know exactly how the beads are designed. Absolute humidity is how much water vapor is in the air. Relative humidity is the amount of water in the air divided by the amount of water the air can hold at a certain temperature. RH is what your hygrometer measures. When temperature goes up so does the airs ability to hold water thus increasing the humidity. So, when you move your humidor to a warmer climate it makes sense that the humidity would go up. The thing I can't figure out is why don't the beads account for this. I'm having to assume the beads are set to adjust to a 65% humidity at 70 degrees. That's the only thing that makes sense to me.
 

Len___T

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So move it out of the cool room into a warmer one then...Thanks Fp...I was wondering if the temp had anything to do with the humidity going up...I know when it gets hot here its like a swamp with all the humidity we have being next to the ohio river..now just where to put it so the dogs dont trash it lol...
 

sleepydoc

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Good discussion of humidity with water vapor/temp table that I came across:


Humidity

Cigars should be stored in an environment that permits the cigar to be smoked at its best. Many authors have suggested that this "ideal" environment be around 70 ºF with a relative humidity of 70%. If a cigar is too dry, it will smoke hot, fast and unevenly. If a cigar is too moist, it will tend to go out frequently, draw will become harder, and it runs the risk of molding in storage. Either of these extremes is undesirable.

Thus, it is recommended that cigars are stored in humidors (boxes that are designed to maintain a constant environment for cigars to rest) to maintain them in peak condition for smoking.

Humidors range from inexpensive containers with humidification devices to works of art that showcase the wood workers' skills and cost multiple thousands of dollars. Which one is best? - If the humidity and temperature is controlled appropriately, either the budget version or the "break the bank" version will perform equally well.

The one thing both humidors have in common is that they contain a regulation device to control the humidity inside the storage container at a given temperature. These devices range in complexity from low-tech (a sponge soaked in water at the bottom of the humidor or brass containers with a clay substance to hold moisture and release moisture i.e. the Dunhill system) to devices that use blotting paper to hold and release moisture. Low-tech devices often require the owner to adjust the humidification device to maintain the desired humidification.

Another device, thought to be one of the best, is the Credo System (registered trademark). The Credo System comes in both a small model (the Rondo) capable of handling 25 - 50 cigars, and the larger model, the Precision 70 which is capable of handling 75 - 100 cigars. Obviously, for larger storage requirements, multiple Credo units can be used.

The beauty of the Credo System is that it is self-regulating. All you have to do is add distilled water to keep the device saturated, and it will maintain a constant 70% relative humidity at 70 ºF. This is accomplished by using special "Credo Solution", which contains both distilled water and a "tensio-active" agent. The tensio-active agent releases moisture when the RH is too low, and absorbs moisture when the RH is too high. It has been determined that the "tensio-active" agent in the Credo units is nothing more or less than propylene glycol, and the units come pre-charged with this agent. You then add distilled water until the unit is saturated with water, and install in your storage. After several months, Credo recommends that you "recharge" your unit with "Credo Juice" (which is for all intents and purposes a 50-50 mix of propylene glycol), due to the fact that the tensio-active agent is slowly consumed when in use.

Many cigar smokers have begun to make their own humidification devices based on this information. Sponges are commonly used to hold propylene glycol and distilled water, but a better choice appears to be the green foam used by florists in flower arrangements (brand name is OASIS). OASIS is available from your local florist and often from craft shops. A large brick of this foam is enough to make a number of humidifiers and can be purchased for a very affordable sum. The foam is soaked with propylene glycol, distilled water is added until the foam will no longer accept any more distilled water. This is then placed (in an appropriate ventilated container) into the storage container, to maintain the cigars in peak condition.

Although humidity levels are almost always referred in terms of Relative Humidity, the actual value that is important is the amount of water vapor present in a given volume of air, known as Absolute Humidity. As air will hold varying amounts of water vapor at different temperatures, no discussion
of humidification would be complete without a discussion of temperature and it's effect on absolute humidity. Relative humidity is an easily measured value that relates the measured humidity to the maximum humidity that is possible at that temperature. Thus, 70% RH at 70 ºF is not the same as 70% RH at 80 ºF.

We are aiming to maintain the same amount of water (mgm/liter) around our cigars as seen at 70% RH at 70 degrees F (which is 13.15 mmHg water vapor pressure).

So, to be able to know what is happening with our cigars at temperatures other than 70 degrees F, we must use a table of adjusted relative humidity values to make sure that our humidors keep our cigars in the peak of condition.


Temperature, water vapor pressure and relative humidity required to equal 70% RH at 70 degrees (13.15mmHg).

Temp
Water Vapor Pressure
Relative Humidity

66
16.37
80.33%

67
16.95
77.58%

68
17.55
74.93%

69
18.17
72.37%

70
18.79
70.00%

71
19.45
67.61%

72
20.11
65.39%

73
20.81
63.19%

74
21.51
61.13%

75
22.25
59.10%

76
23.00
57.17%


It is not possible to attain an absolute humidity level that will keep cigars from drying out at temperatures below 60 degrees F. This observation will put to rest the fallacy that the refrigerator is a good place to store cigars. Not only do we have to worry about our premium cigars beginning to acquire the flavors from left over foods but the cigars will dry out and become essentially unsmokable. The freezer is an even worse place to store cigars. The humidity becomes virtually zero, and the loss of moisture from cigars will accelerate to produce a bone-dry smoke.
 
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Yea, the temperature plays a crucial role in relative humidity. I think the beads like 70 degree F. But, I'll tell you I used to be very anal about my humidity. In only the last month have I become less concerned about a few percentage points. My top shelf sits at about 61% most of the time while my bottom at around 66%. All the cigars smoke great.
 
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I have never read that piece but it makes sense. It also puts an interesting spin on storing your cigars in cooler temperatures. By reading that it would make one think that if you are storing your CC in a 65 degrees cooler then you would actually want a Rh of around 76% It also makes one not trust the RH the hygrometer is reading if you are not at 70 degrees since the importance is placed on absolute humidity. That was very educational.
 

sleepydoc

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I have never read that piece but it makes sense. It also puts an interesting spin on storing your cigars in cooler temperatures. By reading that it would make one think that if you are storing your CC in a 65 degrees cooler then you would actually want a Rh of around 76% It also makes one not trust the RH the hygrometer is reading if you are not at 70 degrees since the importance is placed on absolute humidity. That was very educational.


It is, but I'm with you. If my cigar feels good in my hand, draws and burns well, and the humidor humidity is not way out of whack, I don't stress over the number.
 
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:yes: agreed but it's fun talking about. I think it matters more to the guys storing away boxes for the next 20 years. I am not one of those guys. I don't have the patience to age my own cigars.
 

Len___T

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Just a no0b who doesnt wat to ruin the cigars I got from indy, as well as my recent purchases. As they were/are outstanding.(robs). I havent tried any of my recent purchases) So far not a bad one yet and all I had them in was a lil desktop humi...bought ny new 300ct humi and I just dont want to screw up my cigars and so far everyone here has been very helpful with the ?'s I have posted. Matter of fact I think I'm going to fire up the "Boli" this evening whilst watching UFC...len
 

Wasch_24

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Regardless of the temp or absolute humidity level I like my RH to stay near 65%.

I NEVER worry about the absolute humidity nor the effect of the temperature on the RH...I just keep 'em near 65% and don't worry about it.
 
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No worries Len they'll be fine just keep soem beads in there and try to keep humi full...I have humis and coolers that are full and have'nt had to touch them in years..
 
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