Perdomo patriarchs

[CBC]

Hello, bruthus.
Just picked up new perdomo patriarch's. The cigar looked "too good to be true" by appearance, and had that tell-tale smell of raisins. What i'm talking about here is cigar dying or painting and likely flavoring.

Sure enough, the surface of the wrapper was sticky and upon further testing, coloring rubbed off to reveal a more brown wrapper than black. I cut the foot off for the second test, and sure enough, the foot is shades blacker than the filler/binder behind it. Conclusion: Perdomo dyes cigars. The question is: With what? Probably flavorings and colors of what origin it's impossible to know.

Having taken apart many cigars looking suspect, i've discovered and will reveal here what i've found:
1)rocky patel - unreal! The old worlds are so rediculous. The wrapper is jet black, but underneath, brown. Dyed foot, also. Dye came off on fingers.
2)alec bradley - ditto
3)oliva - dyed
4)nick perdomo - dyed the patriarchs. I won't be buying any more of his line. I will not support posers.
5)pinar del rio - yes, the new release.
6)cao - brazilia. What a load of crap. I took this one apart and found major coloring/flavoring on the wrapper.

Conclusion: Flavorings mask inferior, flawed or cheaper tobacco.
Presentation is so important that rather than hold to tradition, and the fantastic variations nature alone provides, these deceivers decided to sell -us- out for their profit. Do we know what's in any of this? No! And that's the way they want it.

P.s.: Drew was the only responder to email request reainting and he stated they use only natural touchups, ie:from tobacco stain or oils that occur while working with leaf.

 

[stephen_hannibal]

How do you tell the difference between dyed and oil?
I have never had any of the coloring come off a cigar.

 

[Zeuceone]

Having one right now and wrapper is the same color inside.

 

[Sin]

Pretty ballsy stuff; shouldn't be in the Habanos Cigar Reviews section however.

 

[terrantheman]

What about Viajes Satori line?

 

[CBC]

Initially, there's a chalky feel to the wrapper, vs. smooth. Then, I wet my finger and rub it lightly on the wrapper. Then, I cut the foot off and match it to the filler behind it. Then, there's an odd aroma of prunes/black raisins.

 

[CBC]

Zeuc, allowing for some variances, just wet your finger and rub it a couple of strokes along the wrapper. I quickly got a kind of syrup.

I agree, the color is close, but the other clues scream coloring/flavoring.

I'm not trying to stir anything here, I'm just tired of dealing with this when I like a brand generally, and want to support "honest" cigar makers that also produce what I like. And, I'm keenly aware of the physics behind 'what happens when things burn'. It's something to think about. Hey, I just want good & honest smokes.

 

[CBC]

How do you tell the difference between dyed and oil?
I have never had any of the coloring come off a cigar.

See reply below. I must add that I don't know about the oil, except to say that anything that glistens a little too much is probably oil. I've yet to see a real cigar that looks "oily". Ask any old-schoolers and u'll probably find out that cigars never looked like they do nowadays. The market and competition is so fierce that they're creating "poser sticks" for commercial appeal.

Don't support it!

Don't fall for it!

 

[La Chupacabra]

"posers" ?

 

[njstone]

First off, you can't tell anything conclusively by the methods you're using here. Steve Saka, Pete Johnson, and others have spoken on this extensively here and elsewhere. Feel free to look those up and do a bit more research before to categorically claim that most cigar manufacturers are frauds. That's not how we roll here.

Second, color and flavor are completely seperate. Even those who do what we'd call "dying" their cigars (which is a HUGE number of brands, including some of the favorites on this board) use parts of the tobacco leaf itself to make the color, and it's flavorless.

Third, your "conclusion" statement is completely unrelated to the rest of your post. Yes, flavored cigars tend to use inferior tobacco ... but augenting a wrappers color and "flavorings" are completely different things. None of the cigars you "tested" in this flawed manner were flavored cigars. They are all traditional cigars that use premium tobacco.

Finally, if you don't like cigars with "fake" color, that's totally fine. I don't like it either. If it really bothers you, don't buy them. That's the only thing that will change the situation anyway ... money talks. But to be honest with you, if you really intend to rule out ANY manufacturer that colors any cigar, you will have very few cigar companies left to purchase from. Very few indeed.

 

[CBC]

Pretty ballsy stuff; shouldn't be in the Habanos Cigar Reviews section however.

Ballsy? Well, I'll tell u what's ballsy, bruthu...selling cigars that are doctored-up with coloring and/or flavoring.

I'm paying the bill here, and not for an artificial concoction that I'm not warned or told about.

A guy sent out emails to all of the majors asking about dying. Guess what?
NOBODY RESPONDED except Drew.

Consider this thread as a cigar review topic, as it has to do w/construction and aroma, pre-light.

 

[CBC]

What about Viajes Satori line?

Don't know. I suggest performing the tests I've noted here on any/every cigar line u consider.

 

[Zeuceone]

Never mind looks like theres some dye on the ash tray where I let it sit

 

[CBC]

"posers" ?

Oh, Yeah!

Poser Sticks! Look at the Rocky Patel Old Worlds. Purely rediculous!

 

[La Chupacabra]

I think your hypotesis is way off the mark. But with that said, your are intitled to your opinion.

 

[CBC]

First off, you can't tell anything conclusively by the methods you're using here. Steve Saka, Pete Johnson, and others have spoken on this extensively here and elsewhere. Feel free to look those up and do a bit more research before to categorically claim that most cigar manufacturers are frauds. That's not how we roll here.

Second, color and flavor are completely seperate. Even those who do what we'd call "dying" their cigars (which is a HUGE number of brands, including some of the favorites on this board) use parts of the tobacco leaf itself to make the color, and it's flavorless.

Third, your "conclusion" statement is completely unrelated to the rest of your post. Yes, flavored cigars tend to use inferior tobacco ... but augenting a wrappers color and "flavorings" are completely different things. None of the cigars you "tested" in this flawed manner were flavored cigars. They are all traditional cigars that use premium tobacco.

Finally, if you don't like cigars with "fake" color, that's totally fine. I don't like it either. If it really bothers you, don't buy them. That's the only thing that will change the situation anyway ... money talks. But to be honest with you, if you really intend to rule out ANY manufacturer that colors any cigar, you will have very few cigar companies left to purchase from. Very few indeed.

I have carefully read and considered what u have said here. It is fraud when a cigar is dyed/colored and/or flavored without disclosure. I've never said "most mfrs. are frauds". I never said that or implied it. I'm not happy with it, but I'm also leaving the door open 1%, just incase they want to prove me wrong. I named the specific mfrs. and exact cigars that exhibit one or more signs of dying. It's an issue consumers of any product should be aware of. It is up to you to decide if fraud is being committed. I've already stated that I do. This is a consumable item and some of the residue is ingested/absorbed. As a result, a cause-and-effect chain exists.

I do not count coloring/flavoring w/natural extracts from tobacco, as Drew states in his email response to the blogger that wrote some of the major producers.

How much knowledge do u really have about cigar production? Well, I have it that on a tour of Rocky Patel, there's a "Painting Station", by two people who witnessed the live production of Old Worlds. Rocky chose not to respond to an email from another blogger that made the direct inquiry. I took the Old World apart down to the filler. It's the worst of all that I've examined. It's folly to suggest I'm lying. I'm telling the complete truth as I experience checking all of my cigars for dying, then, I share that information w/the unsuspecting. I doubt if it would put even a small dent in anyone's business. Clearly by the response, it remains a major issue.

It this is not "how u roll it" here, then take the steps to get me booted. I really don't care what happens, and that's because I'm not a sheep.

Step to that, Bruthu!

 

[CBC]

Never mind looks like theres some dye on the ash tray where I let it sit

Well, then...u'r good to go!

 

[megladon8]

Why is this in the Habano section?

 

[njstone]

Fact: CBC joined BOTL 4 days prior to posting this almost identical thread:

http://www.botl.org/community/forums/showthread.php?t=43672

Fact: He has posted very little outside of this original thread and the nearly identical one he's posted now

Advice: It's not wise to show up to a board as a newbie and post threads with an inflammatory attitude. Although I take issue with some of your content, the real issue is your attitude.

You don't call good people like Nick Perdomo frauds and posers, period. You certainly don't do it with the BS you're calling fact. Nick is a good guy who has LOWERED cigar prices over the last 2 years when nearly everyone else has raised them. He makes good quality cigars.

You're got zero cred here, "Bruthu," and with it comes no benefit of the doubt. I consider you a TROLL. Be gone with you.

 

[CBC]

I think your hypotesis is way off the mark. But with that said, your are intitled to your opinion.

Thanks for affirming free speech/opinion.
My evidence is not hypothesis. The Mark -is- what u witness by what u see, feel and smell. I've just provided ample evidence of coloring. If u are challenging my conclusion, then the only remedy is that u go into your humidor and pick out any of the cigars I've mentioned and perform the same tests.

It sounds like u don't care about the issue, and that's totally o.k. w/me.