Possible Physics Breakthrough

[ChazHollywood]

CERN believes they've clocked particles moving faster than the speed of light. If they're right this could well turn General Relativity on it's ear...

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EU_BREAKING_LIGHT_SPEED?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT

-Charles

 

[Danilo]

link goes no where for me.

 

[ChazHollywood]

Try it now, I think I fixed it.

-Charles

 

[dpricenator]

Sorry guys test driving my new smart car. I put some bad ass batteries in it and it's fast

 

[Alwayslit]

Warp speed baby!!

 

[wilfredsimpson]

Warp speed baby!!

In all reality, this could suddenly be actually possible. If they are able to verify their findings, this is will go down in history as the equivalent to discovering fire or inventing the wheel. This is huge.

 

[avantgrade]

Very slick!

It will be very interesting to see how this evolves and if further confirmation will surface.

 

[Alwayslit]

In all reality, this could suddenly be actually possible. If they are able to verify their findings, this is will go down in history as the equivalent to discovering fire or inventing the wheel. This is huge.

....this is some game changing stuff.

 

[njstone]

This is fascinating. However, Einstein's theory of E=Mc2 has already been shown not to be valid in all instances, because it's been shown now that the speed of light is not a constant, but is universally slowing down.

I just LOVE the part in this article where most of the other scientists say "this can't be real." That sums up the history of scientific discoveries so well, lol. Everyone is so confident of what they know for sure, then when it's discovered that things are different than they thought (the world is not flat, the sun doesn't revolve around the earth, there is nothing smaller than a cell, etc etc), they react by saying it's "not possible" rather than accept that they might not have the complete explanation of reality like they thought they did. Science has always been one of the more arrogant fields (coming from a college science major).

 

[orangedog]

This is fascinating. However, Einstein's theory of E=Mc2 has already been shown not to be valid in all instances, because it's been shown now that the speed of light is not a constant, but is universally slowing down.

I just LOVE the part in this article where most of the other scientists say "this can't be real." That sums up the history of scientific discoveries so well, lol. Everyone is so confident of what they know for sure, then when it's discovered that things are different than they thought (the world is not flat, the sun doesn't revolve around the earth, there is nothing smaller than a cell, etc etc), they react by saying it's "not possible" rather than accept that they might not have the complete explanation of reality like they thought they did. Science has always been one of the more arrogant fields (coming from a college science major).

Exactly - very well put.

Thanks for the link... the implications could be very exciting!

 

[themoneycollector]

This is why batteries that have been in your freezer can be reused 2 or 3 times. :rolling:

 

[mcroom]

Beam me up Scotty!

 

[ciggy]

Doesn't mean anything to me as I'll most likely die of old age before it really matters...See how I used the word "matter" right there.:halfgrinw

 

[ChazHollywood]

That sums up the history of scientific discoveries so well, lol. Everyone is so confident of what they know for sure, then when it's discovered that things are different than they thought (the world is not flat, the sun doesn't revolve around the earth, there is nothing smaller than a cell, etc etc), they react by saying it's "not possible" rather than accept that they might not have the complete explanation of reality like they thought they did. Science has always been one of the more arrogant fields (coming from a college science major).

I don't think it's arrogance so much as healthy skepticism.

For the last hundred years all of the mathematical models and experimental evidence have agreed that nothing moves faster than light. Now one team, in one lab has conducted one experiment and said "hold on, actually, we may all be wrong".

From the article it sounds like even the scientists that conducted the experiment are skeptical of the results. This is a big, history-making breakthrough for them, but only if another team can actually reproduce and verify their results.

In the even these results ARE actually confirmed, the upheaval should be amazing to watch.

-Charles

 

[Strickland]

That's the way science works - or at least, the way it's supposed to work. Make observations, come up with a theory, and test it. If it tests out, you can make it a "law". Newton's "laws" reigned supreme until Einstein found some instances where they couldn't be applied and modified them until they fit. Einsteins "laws" will only reign supreme until they're improved upon as well.

Science thrives on skepticism. Depends on it, in fact.

And technically speaking, relativity doesn't claim that nothing can travel faster than the speed of light. It claims that nothing that starts out slower then the SoL can be accelerated past the SoL.

 

[swingerofbirches]

This is fascinating. However, Einstein's theory of E=Mc2 has already been shown not to be valid in all instances, because it's been shown now that the speed of light is not a constant, but is universally slowing down.

I just LOVE the part in this article where most of the other scientists say "this can't be real." That sums up the history of scientific discoveries so well, lol. Everyone is so confident of what they know for sure, then when it's discovered that things are different than they thought (the world is not flat, the sun doesn't revolve around the earth, there is nothing smaller than a cell, etc etc), they react by saying it's "not possible" rather than accept that they might not have the complete explanation of reality like they thought they did. Science has always been one of the more arrogant fields (coming from a college science major).

Couldn't agree more ... in the world of Science, everything is (and has been) indisputable law, until it isn't (wasn't) any more. It's surprising that people can work in such a historically shifting and even capsizing field yet be so resolutely sure that they've got it right.

"That men do not learn very much from the lessons of history is the most important of all the lessons of history." - Aldous Huxley

Although, the quickest way to defile an ideal is to insert your own ego into the equation.

And I think skepticism is healthy as long as the intention behind the skepticism is scientific rather then ego-centric or motivated by funding. For a lot of people science is a business, not a calling or a pursuit.

 

[bballbaby]

So when do I get to travel back to 1969?!?!

amzing stuff in all seriousness though

 

[ChazHollywood]

Couldn't agree more ... in the world of Science, everything is (and has been) indisputable law, until it isn't (wasn't) any more. It's surprising that people can work in such a historically shifting and even capsizing field yet be so resolutely sure that they've got it right.

It's just a matter of going where the evidence takes you. If you're doing it right you trust the evidence you have. If new evidence shows up that doesn't fit your old model, first you examine the hell out of the evidence to make sure it is what it claims to be. If it holds up to scrutiny, you adjust your model.

How else would you do it?

And I think skepticism is healthy as long as the intention behind the skepticism is scientific rather then ego-centric or motivated by funding. For a lot of people science is a business, not a calling or a pursuit.

This is, unfortunately, true of any human endeavor. This is why starting from a position of skepticism and requiring peer review are so important. They help to mitigate the effects of human ego on the process.

I promise you that if these results are verified there will be individual scientists that have a very hard time accepting the results. Because they're human, and they've spent their lives set in a particular world view. Science, as a field, however, will move on past them.

-Charles

 

[Burning Man]

The beauty of science is that belief/disbelief drive experiments to prove or disprove the issue. Belief is only a factor until evidence is provided. There is only issue when someone falls in love with a theory and continues trying to create proof where there is none. The only thing that is set in stone is that there will be change. I completely agree that collaboration and information sharing is key.
I smell Nobel Prize!

 

[swingerofbirches]

It's just a matter of going where the evidence takes you. If you're doing it right you trust the evidence you have. If new evidence shows up that doesn't fit your old model, first you examine the hell out of the evidence to make sure it is what it claims to be. If it holds up to scrutiny, you adjust your model.

How else would you do it?

I think you misunderstood my intent ... It's not about the model. Any time you work with uncertainties and unpredictable variables, you do the best you can with what you have ... after all, you only know one thing until you know better.
My criticism is directed at the general hubris of Science. The best way to stop real progress is to look at the last 150 years of advancements and say "those tards got it wrong ... now i've got it right".
It's just beyond me how someone can look at the advances of the last 20 years alone without concluding "here's what I've come up with and I think it's the best we've got right now". A dash of humility goes a long way ...
It's just a shame that the folks who are humbled and awed by great discovery are rarely the ones who get the spotlight.
And all this speaks to your comment below ... it's the human condition. In almost any instance, the vocal minority usually gives the sane majority a bad name ...

This is, unfortunately, true of any human endeavor. This is why starting from a position of skepticism and requiring peer review are so important. They help to mitigate the effects of human ego on the process.

I promise you that if these results are verified there will be individual scientists that have a very hard time accepting the results. Because they're human, and they've spent their lives set in a particular world view. Science, as a field, however, will move on past them.

-Charles

Obviously there's no quick fix for the human ego. It's just harder to accept arrogance from someone who claims that their life is ruled by logic and reason and the scientific process then from an athelete or someone who doesn't profess to be a "great mind".

Either way, just my 2 cents ...